More Discussions for this daf
1. Erusin and Nisu'in 2. Kal V'Chomer With Shifchah Kena'anis 3. Ben Bagbag & Reb Yehudah Ben beseirah
4. 10B "Simpon" & Derabanan
DAF DISCUSSIONS - KIDUSHIN 10

Daniel Sheinfil asks:

Bkvod Harav

I don't understand the hava Amina of the kal vechomer with a shifcha kinanis.

Biah with a shifcha kinanis does nothing, isn't it even asur?

How can it be used in a kal vechomer?

Thank you.

Kol Tuv

The Kollel replies:

Hi Daniel,

I know your question is great, because the Ramban asks it.

The Ramban says that the Gemara does not really mean to learn from a Kal va'Chomer but rather from the Kinyan Kesef by a Shifcha which is enough to allow her to eat Truma, so also Kinyan Kesef of an Arusa will allow her to eat Truma.

The Gemara added the Kal va'Chomer only to strengthen the above, but the Kal va'Chomer is not really good, since Biah is not a Kinyan by a Shifcha and is also prohibited as you wrote.

well done,

Aharon Steiner

Avraham asks:

Lkavod ha Kollel...why shifcha , why not a male עכו״ם...

Why throw in what's at least a lav deoraisah

Why not stage one of Amah Ivriya- it's been used before? Despite the new Adon being podeh or conducting yiud as he should-yiud is a secondary kinyan and may or may not happen.

Or an Eved Ivri nirtzah or not never eats terumah. The adon gives his shifcha to the eved Ivri year 6 comes offspring are not connected to him, he doesn't have to give her a get.. multiple places it's mentioned that it's preferable to do this for an eved that's married to prevent a Nirtzah situation. The Gemara makes no distinction if beis din sold him because of inability to pay back as a Ganav or someone in aniyus requires parnasa.

It's been well established that with yerusha etc... the unfreed shifcha Canaanite while owned by the Kohen can eat Terumah. If she attains a get shichrur she's a Ger Tzedek and can't marry a kohen or be in a scenario where she can eat Terumah. A BAs Kohen if she's offspring free eats her fathers Terumah.

There are a myriad of kinyanim that have stronger Tzad Hashaveh ..... the choice of shifcha is used because she's a woman? Her status is no different than an eved Canaanite. But males or animals would include a lav that has Kareis. Is the bringer of this kal vchomer telling us that biah with a non Jew is a Lav without Kareis?