KIDUSHIN 32-33 - Ari Kornfeld has generously sponsored the Dafyomi publications for thIs Daf for the benefit of Klal Yisrael.

1)

EXEMPTIONS FROM STANDING

(a)

(Beraisa) Suggestion: Perhaps one must give money to the Zaken to honor him.

(b)

Rejection: "You will rise and honor" - just like one does not lose money by rising, one need not lose by honoring.

(c)

Question: Why do we assume that one does not lose money by rising?

1.

Does not the verse include a man drilling through pearls (to thread them, a very lucrative job), and he must stop working when he rises?

(d)

Answer: The verse equates rising to honoring. Just like one need not desist (from working) to honor (honor connotes through gifts or verbally), also to rise.

1.

The verse also equates honoring to rising. Just like one does not lose money by rising, one need not lose by honoring.

2.

From here we learn that craftsmen are not allowed (alternatively - obligated) to rise for Chachamim.

(e)

Question (Mishnah): (When people come to Yerushalayim bringing Bikurim (first fruits), all craftsmen rise for them, greet them and bless them.

(f)

Answer (R. Yochanan): They must rise for people bringing Bikurim, but not for Chachamim.

(g)

(Rebbi Yosi bar Avin): This shows the greatness of one doing a Mitzvah. He is honored more than Chachamim!

(h)

Rejection: Perhaps he is not worthy of such honor. Chachamim enacted to honor people bringing Bikurim, lest they decide not to come again.

(i)

(Beraisa) Suggestion: Perhaps one must rise in the privy or bathhouse...

(j)

Question: Is one truly exempt?!

1.

Once, in the bathhouse, R. Shimon bar Rebbi walked by R. Chiya (and on another occasion, Bar Kapara), who had learned from him, yet he did not rise for R. Shimon. R. Shimon complained to Rebbi.

2.

Rebbi: Perhaps he was thinking about what you taught him, and he did not notice you.

3.

Inference: Had he noticed, he would be obligated to rise!

(k)

Answer: One is obligated to rise in the outer rooms of a bathhouse, but not in the inner rooms.

(l)

Support: These cases must have been in the outer rooms.

1.

(Rabah bar bar Chanah): One may think about Torah anywhere except for a privy or (the inner rooms of) a bathhouse.

(m)

Rejection: Sometimes a Chacham cannot avoid thinking about Torah in these places.

(n)

(Beraisa) Suggestion: Perhaps one may close his eyes as if he does not see the Zaken.

(o)

Question: Does the Beraisa discuss Resha'im?!

(p)

Answer: It means, perhaps one may close his eyes before the Chacham is so close that he will need to rise if he sees him;

1.

"You will rise and you will fear" teaches that one may not.

(q)

(Beraisa): Rising that shows honor is when the Chachamim is within four Amos.

(r)

(Abaye): This is for a Chacham who is not his primary Rebbi. For one's primary Rebbi, he must rise as soon as he can see him.

1.

Abaye would rise as soon as he saw the ear of the donkey on which Rav Yosef (his Rebbi) used to ride.

(s)

Abaye was riding on the bank of a river; Rav Mesharshiya and other Chachamim were on the other side; they did not rise.

1.

Abaye: Am I not your primary Rebbi?!

2.

Chachamim: We did not notice you.

2)

HOW THE ZAKEN SHOULD ACT

(a)

(Beraisa - R. Shimon ben Elazar): "Zaken and you will fear" teaches that he should not unnecessarily cause people to stand for him.

(b)

(Abaye): If the Zaken takes a longer route to avoid making people stand for him, his life will be lengthened.

1.

Abaye and R. Zeira used to take longer routes.

(c)

Ravina was sitting in front of R. Yirmiyah mi'Difti. A man passed by without covering his head.

1.

Ravina: That man is so brazen!

2.

R. Yirmiyah: Perhaps he is from the city of Machsiya. People there are used to Chachamim, and feel informal with them.

(d)

(Isi ben Yehudah): "You will rise in front of an elder" - any elder.

(e)

(R. Yochanan): The Halachah follows Isi.

(f)

R. Yochanan would rise for Nochri elders, because they have experienced many afflictions and many miracles.

1.

Rava would not rise for them, but he would show honor.

2.

Abaye would give them a hand.

3.

Rava and Rav Nachman would send messengers to give them a hand.

i.

Rav Nachman thought that it would belittle the honor of Torah if he himself would help them.

33b----------------------------------------33b

3)

RISING FOR ONE'S REBBI

(a)

(R. Eibo): A Chachamim may not rise for his Rebbi more than twice a day, morning and evening, lest he honor his Rebbi more than he honors Hash-m (he says Shema Yisrael only twice a day).

(b)

Question (Beraisa - R. Shimon ben Elazar): "Zaken, you will fear" teaches that a Zaken should not cause that people will have to rise for him.

1.

If others must rise only twice a day, they should do so! What is wrong if he makes them rise?!

2.

Rather, we must say that they must rise every time he passes!

(c)

Answer: Really, people need rise only twice a day. Still, the Zaken should minimize how much they must rise for him.

(d)

(R. Elazar): Any Chacham who does not rise for his Rebbi is called wicked. He will not live long, and he will forget his learning.

1.

"A Rasha will not live long... who does not fear Hash-m" refers to (not) rising for a Chacham, about which it says "you will fear Hash-m".

2.

Question: Perhaps it refers to usury or false measures, about which it says "you will fear Hash-m"!

3.

Answer: R. Elazar learns from a Gezeirah Shavah "Pnei-Pnei".

(e)

Question: If a son is his father's Rebbi, should he rise for his father?

(f)

Answer: Yes. Rav Yehudah taught his father, yet Shmuel told Rav Yehudah to rise for his father.

(g)

Rejection: Rav Yehudah's father is an exception. He was an awesome Tzadik, and even Shmuel used to rise for him.

(h)

Question: If so, why did Shmuel need to tell Rav Yehudah to rise for him? (Surely, this was to teach that a son must rise for his father, even if he is his Rebbi?)

(i)

Answer: He told him that when Rav Yehudah's father enters after Shmuel, he should only rise when his father enters (Shmuel pardoned the honor due to himself).

(j)

Question: Must a man rise for his son, if his son is his Rebbi?

(k)

Answer: R. Yehoshua ben Levi said 'the only reason I rise for my son is because he married into the family of the Nasi.'

1.

Inference: This is because R. Yehoshua ben Levi was his son's Rebbi. Had he been his son's Talmid, that would (also) require him to rise for him!

(l)

Rejection: No. He meant, even if my son were my Rebbi, that would not obligate me to rise for him, for he is my son;

1.

I would rise for him only due to the honor of the Nasi.

(m)

Question: Is riding like walking (if a Chacham rides by, must people rise for him)?

(n)

Answer (Abaye - Mishnah): If someone with Tum'as Tzara'as sits under a tree, and a Tahor person stands underneath, the latter becomes Tamei;

1.

If the Metzora stands under a tree and the Tahor sits underneath, he remains Tahor;

2.

If the Metzora sat down, the Tahor person would become Tamei.

3.

The same applies to a stone from a house with Tzara'as (that Ploni is holding, under a tree. It is Metamei Tehorim under the tree only if Ploni sits.)

i.

(Rav Nachman bar Kohen): This teaches that riding is like walking. (Just like the law of the stone depends on the person holding it, also one riding is like the animal carrying him, i.e. like one who is walking.)

(o)

Question: Must one rise for a Sefer Torah?

(p)

Answer (R. Chilkiyah and...): We stand for those that learn Torah, all the more so for a Torah itself!

(q)

R. Ilai and R. Yakov bar Zavdi rose for R. Shemen bar Aba.

1.

R. Shemen: That was unnecessary! Firstly, you are also Chachamim;

2.

Secondly, people engaging in Torah need not stand for those that learn it!

i.

(R. Elazar): A Chacham may not rise for his Rebbi while he is learning.

(r)

Abaye would curse those who ruled like R. Elazar.

4)

HOW FAR DOES ONE STAND FOR CHACHAMIM?

(a)

(R. Ami or R. Yitzchak Nafcha): "They looked at Moshe until he entered the tent" - they looked contemptuously;

(b)

(The other of R. Ami and R. Yitzchak Nafcha): This teaches how long one must stand when the Nasi passes.

1.

(Chizkiyah): One must rise when a Chacham comes within four Amos. When he (leaves and) is four Amos away, one may sit;

2.

One must rise when he sees the head of Beis Din coming. When he (leaves and) is four Amos away, one may sit;

3.

For the Nasi, one must rise when one sees him coming. When he sits in his place, one may sit - "they looked at Moshe until he entered the tent."

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