1)

(a)Rav Gidal Amar Rav interprets 'she'be'ben ve'she'be'bas' in the current Beraisa, with regard to Erchin. What is the Beraisa then coming to teach us?

(b)Why might we have thought otherwise?

(c)Why does the Tana not then also insert the Erech of a sixty year-old in his list?

(d)How does Rav Yosef interpret 'she'be'ben ve'she'be'bas'? In which regard is the Tana speaking, according to him?

1)

(a)Rav Gidal Amar Rav interprets 'she'be'ben ve'she'be'bas' in the current Beraisa, with regard to Erchin - and the Tana is then coming to teach us that the Erech of a child between the ages of five and twenty begins from his fifth birthday and not from the age of four and one month.

(b)We might have thought otherwise - because the Torah writes there "mi'ben Chamesh Shanim ve'ad ben Esrim Shanah", omitting the word 'va'Ma'alah' ...

(c)... as it mentions with regard to the Erech of a sixty year-old - whom the Tana did not therefore find necessary to insert in his list.

(d)Rav Yosef interprets 'she'be'ben ve'she'be'bas' - with regard to 'bas (and ben) Esrim in our Mishnah (in connection with the Din of Aylonis and Saris).

2)

(a)What did Rav Yosef reply, when Abaye asked him whether he and Rav Gidal Amar Rav disagreed Halachically?

(b)How do we substantiate Rav Yosef's reply? Why can the opinion that establishes it by Erchin not possibly disagree that the bas (and ben) Esrim in our Mishnah means Me'eis Le'eis?

(c)In that case, why did Rav ...

1. ... Gidal Amar Rav not establish the case by a bas (and ben) Esrim?

2. ... Yosef not establish the case by Erchin?

(d)What is the source for the age of twenty marking the Din of Aylonis and Saris?

2)

(a)When Abaye asked Rav Yosef whether he and Rav Gidal Amar Rav disagreed Halachically - he replied in the negative.

(b)We substantiate Rav Yosef's reply by pointing out that the opinion that establishes it by Erchin cannot possibly disagree that the bas (and ben) Esrim in our Mishnah means Me'eis Le'eis - since that is the opinion of Rav, who specifically stated 'Hilch'sa be'Kula Pirkin Me'eis Le'eis'.

(c)And the reason that Rav ...

1. ... Gidal Amar Rav did not establish the case by a bas (and ben) Esrim regarding the Din of Aylonis and Saris is - because unlike the other cases listed in the Beraisa, it is not written specifically in the Pasuk.

2. ... Yosef did not establish the case by Erchin is - because the Beraisa ought then to have replaced 'she'be'ben ve'she'be'bas' with 'she'be'Zachar ve'she'bi'Nekeivah', which is the expression used there by the Pasuk.

(d)The source for the age of twenty marking the Din of Aylonis and Saris is - Halachah le'Moshe mi'Sinai.

3)

(a)What did Rebbi Zeira comment when he heard Rav Yitzchak bar Nachmeni Amar Rebbi Elazar's statement 'Halachah ke'Rebbi Yossi ben Kipar she'Amar Mishum Rebbi Eliezer'?

(b)When did his wish come true?

(c)What did Rebbi Elazar reply, when Rebbi Zeira asked him whether he really said that? What did he mean by 'Mistavra ... '?

3)

(a)When Rebbi Zeira heard Rav Yitzchak bar Nachmeni Amar Rebbi Elazar's statement 'Halachah ke'Rebbi Yossi ben Kipar she'Amar Mishum Rebi Eliezer' (see Tosfos DH 'Amar Rebbi Elazar'), he commented that - he would like to hear it directly from the author's mouth.

(b)His wish came true - after he moved to Eretz Yisrael.

(c)When Rebbi Zeira asked Rebbi Elazar whether he really said that, the latter replied that - what he had said was that it was logical to say that (since in the entire Perek, the Tana states 've'Yom Echad', except for the current Mishnah (like Ula), although he did not have a Kabalah to substantiate his theory.

Hadran Alach 'Yotzei Dofen'

Perek Ba Si'man

4)

(a)What does our Mishnah rule regarding a Yevamah whose Siman ha'Tachton (the pubic hair) has preceded the Siman ha'Elyon (the breasts)?

(b)What does Rebbi Meir rule in the reverse case?

(c)If, as the Chachamim claim, it is impossible for the Siman ha'Elyon to develop before the Siman ha'Tachton, how can they then issue a statement permitting her to perform Chalitzah or Yibum?

(d)How do we reconcile the Mishnah citing Rebbi Meir's ruling regarding a case where the Siman ha'Elyon preceded the Tachton, after having stated that it is impossible?

4)

(a)Our Mishnah rules that a Yevamah whose Si'man ha'Tachton (the pubic hair) has preceded the Si'man ha'Elyon (the breasts) - may perform either Chalitzah or Yibum (since she is a Gedolah [see Tosfos DH 'va'Chachamim Omrim']).

(b)In the reverse case - Rebbi Meir rules 'Lo Choletzes ve'Lo Misyabemes' (because she is still a Ketanah [see Tosfos DH 'Ba Si'man']).

(c)Even though, according to the Chachamim, it is impossible for the Si'man ha'Elyon to develop before the Si'man ha'Tachton, they issue a statement permitting her to perform Chalitzah or Yibum - precisely because it is obvious that the Si'man ha'Tachton must have appeared and fallen out.

(d)And what the Mishnah means when it cites Rebbi Meir's ruling regarding a case where the Si'man ha'Elyon preceded the Tachton, after having stated that it is impossible is that - Rebbi Meir treats her as a Ketanah, even though the Rabbanan consider it impossible.

5)

(a)Why does the Mishnah then find it necessary to mention the fact that the Siman Elyon without the Tachton is impossible? How might we have established their Machlokes had it done so?

(b)What difference would it make if it had?

(c)The Pasuk in Yechezkel "Shadayim Nachonu u'Se'arech Tzime'ach" is not a problem according to Rebbi Meir. What is the problem according to the Rabbanan?

(d)How will they explain the Pasuk?

5)

(a)The Mishnah found it necessary to mention the fact that the Si'man Elyon without the Tachton is impossible, because we would otherwise have assumed that it is possible, but rare, and based the Machlokes on whether we contend with the minority (Rebbi Meir) or not (the Rabbanan [an old Machlokes of theirs).

(b)If it had - we would have confined their Machlokes to S'tam, but where they examined her and did not find Simnei Tachton, even the Rabbanan would concede to Rebbi Meir, that she is a Ketanah.

(c)The Pasuk in Yechezkel "Shadayim Nachonu u'Se'arech Tzime'ach" is not a problem according to Rebbi Meir. It is though, according to the Rabbanan - in whose opinion the Simanim appear in the reverse order.

(d)They therefore explain the Pasuk to mean that - since the (metaphorical) breasts of Yisrael had developed, one could be rest assured that their pubic hair had grown too.

6)

(a)We query the Rabbanan again from the Pasuk there "ba'Asos mi'Mitzrayim Dadayich Lema'an Shadei Ne'urayich". What does the Pasuk mean?

(b)There too, we establish the Pasuk where the Siman ha'Tachton had already developed (see Aruch la'Ner). How do we then reinterpret the word "Shadei" and subsequently explain the Pasuk according to the Rabbanan?

(c)What does the Pasuk now mean?

6)

(a)We query the Rabbanan again from the Pasuk "ba'Asos mi'Mitzrayim Dadayich Lema'an Shadei Ne'urayich" - which translates as " ... when the Egyptians played with your breasts in order to have relations with you when your pubic hair (which was about to sprout) would grow".

(b)There too, we interpret the Pasuk where the Si'man ha'Tachton had already developed (see Aruch la'Ner). We therefore reinterpret the word "Shadei" too - to mean 'breasts' ...

(c)... and the Pasuk is referring first to the beginning of their growth, and then to when they have fully grown (or to when the Egyptians first began to torment them [for which playing with their breasts and causing them to start swelling is a Mashal] and after their breasts had dried up and swollen).

48b----------------------------------------48b

7)

(a)What does Rav Yehudah Amar Rav learn from the Pasuk in Naso "Ish O Ishah ki Ya'asu mi'Kol Chatos ha'Adam"? In what regard is the Pasuk comparing a woman to a man (concerning all punishments in the Torah)?

(b)How do we know that this refers to the Siman ha'Tachton exclusively, and not to whichever one appears first?

(c)What does ...

1. ... Tana de'bei Rebbi Yishmael say?

2. ... Rebbi Eliezer b'Rebbi Tzadok (who also agrees with this ruling) say, quoting the Chachamim in Yavneh?

7)

(a)Rav Yehudah Amar Rav learns from the Pasuk in Naso "Ish O Ishah ki Ya'asu mi'Kol Chatos ha'Adam" that - a woman, just like a man, becomes a bar Onshin (subject to punishment for transgressing La'avin), with one Si'man.

(b)We know that this refers to the Si'man ha'Tachton exclusively, and not to whichever one appears first- from the same source (since a man only has Si'man ha'Tachton).

(c)Tana ...

1. ... de'bei Rebbi Yishmael - says exactly the same as Rav Yehudah Amar Shmuel; whereas ...

2. Rebbi Eliezer b'Rebbi Tzadok (who also agrees with this ruling) quoting the Chachamim in Yavneh states that - once the Si'man ha'Tachton appears, we do not bother with the Si'man ha'Elyon.

8)

(a)In another Beraisa, Rabban Shimon ben Gamliel maintains that the Siman ha'Tachton of the girls who lived in the towns, preceded the Siman ha'Elyon, because they bathed often. What reason does ...

1. ... he give for his statement that regarding girls who live in the villages, the reverse was true?

2. ... Rebbi Shimon ben Elazar give for his statement that the right breast of wealthy girls matured before the left one?

3. ... the latter give for his statement that in poor girls, the reverse was true?

(b)What objection does Rebbi Chanina, Rebbi Yehoshua's nephew, raise to the Tana Kama's statement that the left side preceded the right one? What was the sole exception?

(c)We learned in another Beraisa that all Bedikos of women took place at the hand of women. What did Rebbi Eliezer and Rebbi Yishmael respectively, used to do?

8)

(a)In another Beraisa, Rabban Shimon ben Gamliel maintains that the Si'man ha'Tachton of the girls who lived in the towns preceded the Simanim ha'Elyonim, because they bathed often. The reason ...

1. ... he gives for his statement that regarding girls who lived in the villages, the reverse was the case is that - they tended to grind in the mill, using their arms in the process.

2. ... Rebbi Shimon ben Elazar gives for his statement that the right breast of wealthy girls matured before the left one is that - it was constantly rubbed by the 'Afk'risusa' (a sort of apron worn over the right breast by wealthy girls).

3. ... the latter gives for his statement that in poor girls, the reverse was true is - either that they tended to carry their pitchers of drawn water on the left shoulder, or that they tended to carry their little brothers on their left side.

(b)Rebbi Chanina, Rebbi Yehoshua's nephew objected to the Tana Kama's statement that the left side preceded the right one - because, in his opinion, this only happened once to a girl who lived in his vicinity, and even there, the situation later returned to normal.

(c)We learned in another Beraisa that all Bedikos of women took place at the hand of women. Rebbi Eliezer and Rebbi Yishmael used to hand the girls that required Bedikah to their mother and wife respectively.

9)

(a)What distinction does Rebbi Yehudah draw between before the day that the Siman is due to appear and after the due day on the one hand, and on the day that it is actually due to appear, on the other?

(b)What is the reason for this stringency?

(c)If the women are not believed anyway, what is the point of the examination ...

1. ... before the due date?

2. ... after the due date?

9)

(a)Rebbi Yehudah - permits Bedikah via women before the day that the Si'man is due to appear and after the due day on the one hand, but not on the day that it is actually due to appear, on the other ...

(b)... because it is not possible to resolve a Safek through women (to rely on them outright that so and so is a Gedolah and is permitted to perform Chalitzah).

(c)Even though the women are not believed anyway, the examination ...

1. ... before the due date is necessary - since, in reality, she is a Ketanah anyway, and we only believe them with regard to there where the same Si'man is found after the day that it is due, in which case, as a result of their Bedikah, we will then assume it to be a wart (and not a Si'man).

2. ... after the due date - since, even if they testify that she has Simanim, we would in any case assume that this was the case, and she would have been permitted to perform Chalitzah (due to Chazakah de'Rava); whereas if they testify that she hasn't, she will not be permitted to perform Miy'un in any case, on the assumption that she had Simanim and they fell out.

10)

(a)Rebbi Shimon is more lenient than Rebbi Yehudah. What does he say?

(b)How does he explain this? When are the women believed (as regards Miy'un and Chalitzah) and when are they not?

(c)We already explained why, according to Rebbi Yehudah, women perform the examination before the due date and afterwards. The question remains however, that, seeing as we have Chazakah de'Rava (which we discussed in the previous Perek and) which exempts her from a Bedikah, why is the above Bedikah not pointless?

(d)In that case, why does Rebbi Yehudah not permit women to perform the Bedikah on the due date as well?

10)

(a)Rebbi Shimon is more lenient than Rebbi Yehudah in that - he permits women to perform the Bedikah even on the due date.

(b)And he explains that - they are believed to testify that she is a Gedolah (to prevent her from performing Miy'un) or that she is a Ketanah (to prevent her from performing Chalitzah) exclusively.

(c)We already explained why, according to Rebbi Yehudah, women perform the examination before the due date and afterwards. Despite Chazakah de'Rava which exempts her from a Bedikah, the above Bedikah is not pointless - since Rav is only referring to the Chumra of Miy'un, but not to the Kula of Chalitzah, which is where they are believed.

(d)Nevertheless, Rebbi Yehudah does not permit women to perform the Bedikah on the due date as well - since on the one hand he holds 'Toch Zemano ke'le'Achar Zemano', whilst on the other, he only believes women in conjunction with 'Chazakah de'Rava', which only comes into effect after the due date has passed (but not on the day itself).

11)

(a)On what grounds does Rebbi Shimon permit women to make the Bedikah even on the due date?

(b)What is then the point of the Bedikah?

(c)The author of 've'Ne'emenes Ishah Lehachmir ve'Lo Lehakel' (following Rebbi Shimon's ruling) could be either Rebbi Yehudah or Rebbi Shimon. To which case will it refer, according to ...

1. ... Rebbi Yehudah?

2. ... Rebbi Shimon? Why is that?

11)

(a)Rebbi Shimon permits women to make the Bedikah even on the due date - because he holds Toch ha'Perek ke'Lifnei ha'Perek.

(b)And the Bedikah is necessary - so that, should the same Si'man still be there after the due date, we will know that it is a wart, and not a Si'man Gadlus (as we already explained).

(c)The author of 've'Ne'emenes Ishah Lehachmir ve'Lo Lehakel' (following Rebbi Shimon's ruling) could be either ...

1. ... Rebbi Yehudah, and it refers - to the date that the Si'man is due to appear, or to ...

2. ... Rebbi Shimon - in which csase it refers to after the due date, because he does not hold of Chazakah de'Rava.

12)

(a)What problem do we have with our Mishnah's conclusion 'Mipnei she'Amru Efshar le'Tachton Lavo ad she'Lo Ba Elyon, Aval I Efshar ... "?

(b)On what grounds do we initially reject the answer that it is a S'tam like the Rabbanan?

(c)Then why do we finally accept it?

(d)What is the alternative answer?

12)

(a)The problem with our Mishnah's conclusion 'Mipnei she'Amru Efshar le'Tachton Lavo ad she'Lo Ba Elyon Aval I Efshar ... " is that - it is merely a repetition of the Rabbanan's opinion, in which case it appears to be superfluous.

(b)Initially, we reject the answer that it is a S'tam like the Rabbanan - since it is anyway obvious that we rule like them.

(c)We finally accept it however - because we might otherwise have ruled like Rebbi Meir, who seems to have the support of the Pesukim in Yechezkel ("Shadayim Nachonu" and "ba'Asos Mitzrayim Dadayich") that we quoted earlier.

(d)Alternatively - Rebbi needed to repeat the last phrase on account of its obvious connection with the next Mishnah (that we are about to learn) 'Keyotzei bo ... ').

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