HORAYOS 6 (14 Elul) - This Daf has been dedicated in honor of the Yahrzeit of Yisrael (son of Chazkel and Miryam) Rosenbaum, who passed away on 14 Elul, by his son and daughter and families.

1)

(a)The Torah writes in Naso (in connection with the inauguration of the Levi'im) "u'Far Sheini ben Bakar Tikach le'Chatas". Bearing in mind that the Torah has already written there "Ve'asah es ha'Echad Chatas ve'es ha'Echad Olah la'Hashem", how does Rebbi Shimon in a Beraisa explain "u'Far Sheini"?

(b)What problem does Rebbi Yossi in a Beraisa have with the Pasuk in Ezra "ha'Ba'im me'ha'Shevi b'nei ha'Golah Hikrivu Olos le'Elokei Yisrael"?

(c)So how does he explain the Pasuk?

(d)Rebbi Yehudah in another Beraisa explains that they brought these Korbanos to atone for the Avodah-Zarah that they had worshipped. Who, according to Rav Yehudah Amar Shmuel, was actually guilty of that sin?

1)

(a)The Torah writes in Naso (in connection with the inauguration of the Levi'im) "u'Far Sheini ben Bakar Tikach le'Chatas". Bearing in mind that the Torah has already written there "Ve'asah es ha'Echad Chatas ve'es ha'Echad Olah la'Hashem", Rebbi Shimon in a Beraisa explains "u'Far Sheini" to mean that - the Torah, comparing the Chatas to the Olah, requires the Chatas to be entirely burned (rather than eaten by the Kohanim, as most Chata'os are).

(b)The problem that Rebbi Yossi in a Beraisa has with the Pasuk "ha'Ba'im me'ha'Shevi b'nei ha'Golah Hikrivu Olos le'Elokei Yisrael" is that - seeing as the Torah is speaking about the twelve goats that they brought as Chata'os, how can it then refer to them as Olos?

(c)He therefore explains the Pasuk (like Rebbi Shimon in the previous Beraisa) to mean - that they were completely burned like Olos (like the Din of Cha'ta'os ha'Penimiyos [whose blood is brought inside the Kodesh]).

(d)Rebbi Yehudah in another Beraisa explains that they brought these Korbanos to atone for the sin of Avodah-Zarah. According to Rav Yehudah Amar Shmuel - it was actually the generation of Tzidkiyahu ha'Meleach (who had gone into exiles seventy years earlier) who had ben guilty of that sin.

2)

(a)According to Rebbi Meir, we have a problem as to why they brought twelve goats. Why is there no problem according to ...

1. ... Rebbi Yehudah?

2. ... Rebbi Shimon?

(b)What is then the problem according to Rebbi Meir?

(c)How do we resolve it?

2)

(a)We have a problem as to why they brought twelve goats, according to Rebbi Meir, not according to ...

1. ... Rebbi Yehudah - because it speaks either where all twelve tribes sinned, in which case each of the twelve tribes would have been obligated to bring one goat, or when seven tribes (or even one tribe [see Chok Nasan]) sinned, and the remaining tribes each brought a Par because of 'G'reirah'.

2. ... Rebbi Shimon - because it speaks where eleven tribes sinned, in which case they would bring one bull each, and the twelfth bull would have been brought by the Beis-Din.

(b)The problem according to Rebbi Meir is that - even if all twelve tribes sinned, they would not need to bring more than one bull.

(c)We resolve it - by establishing that they sinned twelve times.

3)

(a)What happens to a Chatas whose owner died?

(b)How does Rav Papa then explain the fact that Yisrael brought these twelve Chata'os for their ancestors who had already died? Why did they not let the bulls die?

(c)What is the problem with the Pasuk in Tehilim "Tachas Avosecha Yiy'hu Banecha" that we suggest as the source for Rav Papa's statement?

(d)How do we then try to prove it from the goat that the Kohanim brought together with the Musaf of Rosh Chodesh? With which funds was the goat purchased?

3)

(a)A Chatas whose owner died - has to be left to die ('Halachah le'Moshe mi'Sinai') ...

(b)... and Rav Papa attributes the fact that Yisrael brought these twelve Chata'os for their ancestors who had already died - to the fact that a Tzibur does not die.

(c)The problem with the Pasuk "Tachas Avosecha Yiy'hu Banecha" that we suggest as the source for Rav Papa's statement is that - by the same token, the children of any deceased owner should then be allowed to bring the Korban in his stead.

(d)So we try to prove it from the Chatas-goat that the Kohanim brought together with the Musaf of Rosh Chodesh (which was purchased with the money from T'rumas ha'Lishkah) - despite the fact that some of the owners may have died.

4)

(a)On what grounds do we reject the proof from the goat of Rosh Chodesh as Rav Papa's source?

(b)We then cite the Pasuk in Shoftim (in connection with an Eglah Arufah) as a possible source "Kaper le'Amcha Yisrael asher Padisa, Hash-m". How do we explain the final phrase there? How do we prove from there that 'Ein Tzibur Meisah'?

(c)Why can we not refute this proof too, by arguing that ...

1. ... unlike there (by Eglah Arufah [where at least all those who had sinned were definitely alive]), in our case, the sinners (from the generation of Tzidkiyahu) were not?

2. ... even if some of the original sinners were alive, the majority were not?

(d)How do we ...

1. ... answer the Kashya that they sinned on purpose (whereas a Chatas comes for a Shogeg, and not for a Meizid)?

2. ... prove this from the Pasuk itself?

4)

(a)We reject the proof from the goat of Rosh Chodesh as Rav Papa's source - since there it is only a Safek, whereas in our case, it is certain that some of the sinners died (see Metzapeh Eisan and Me'lo ha'Ro'im).

(b)We then cite the Pasuk "Kaper le'Amcha Yisrael asher Padisa, Hash-m" as a possible source - with reference to all those who were redeemed from Egypt (see Maharatz Chayos [and who had definitely died by the time the Beis-Hamikdash was built]), a proof that 'Ein Tzibur Meisah'.

(c)We cannot refute this proof by arguing that ...

1. ... unlike there (by Eglah Arufah [where at least all those who had sinned were definitely alive] - and since it atones for them it will also atone for those who were not), in our case, the sinners (from the generation of Tzidkiyahu) were not - because Ezra specifically refers to 'many of the Kohanim and Levi'im ... ' (from Tzidkiyahu's time) who were still alive at that time.

2. ... even if some of the original sinners were alive, the majority were not - because he also describes how the sound of the blowing of Simchah was drowned by those who were weeping (from embarrassment) when they recalled the magnificence of the first Beis-ha'Mikdash compared to the second.

(d)We ...

1. ... answer the Kashya that they sinned on purpose (whereas a Chatas comes for a Shogeg, and not for a Meizid) by attributing it to a Hora'as Sha'ah (a special ruling by Beis-Din for that time only), and ...

2. ... we prove this from the Pasuk itself - which describes the ninety-six rams and seventy-seven lambs which they also brought, and which have no source other than a Hora'as Sha'ah.

5)

(a)We learned in a Beraisa that if one member of the Tzibur dies, they nevertheless remain obligated to bring the bull, whereas if a member of Beis-Din dies, they are Patur. Why does Rav Chisda ... Amar Rav establish the author of this Beraisa as Rebbi Meir?

(b)On what principle is Rav's ruling based?

(c)Why does this not contravene the principle that we just learned 'Ein Tzibur Meisah'?

(d)Rav Yosef asked why, by the same token, the author cannot be Rebbi Shimon, who holds that Beis-Din as well as the Kahal, are obligated to bring a bull. What did Abaye reply?

5)

(a)We learned in a Beraisa that if one member of the Tzibur dies, they nevertheless remain obligated to bring the bull, whereas if a member of Beis-Din dies, they are Patur. Rav Chisda ... Amar Rav establishes the author of this Beraisa as Rebbi Meir - because he is the one who places the onus of bringing the bull on the Beis-Din.

(b)Rav's ruling is based on the principle - that if one of the joint owners of a Chatas dies, the Chatas has to die.

(c)This does not contravene the principle that we just learned 'Ein Tzibur Meisah' - since Beis-Din are not called a Tzibur (Kahal).

(d)When Rav Yosef asked why, by the same token, the author cannot be Rebbi Shimon, who holds that Beis-Din as well as the Kahal, are obligated to bring a bull, Abaye replied that - according to Rebbi Shimon, the Chatas of partners (meaning any joint owners that are not considered a Kahal either), does not die either.

6)

(a)Abaye's reply is based on another Beraisa, which discusses the bull and the goat of Yom Kipur that got lost, were replaced, and were found before the replacement animals were brought. Rebbi Yehudah rules Yamusu. What do Rebbi Elazar and Rebbi Shimon say?

(b)Does this mean that Rebbi Yehudah considers the Chatas of partners worse than that of a Tzibur?

(c)How does Rav Yosef refute Abaye's proof from the latter? What did he learn from the Pasuk in Acharei-Mos "al ha'Kohanim ve'al Kol Am ha'Kahal Yechaper"?

(d)How do we disprove Rav Yosef's argument from the thirteen bulls that Rebbi Shimon obligates in our Mishnah, in the event that all the tribes sinned be'Shig'gas Hora'ah?

6)

(a)Abaye's reply is based on another Beraisa, which discusses the bull and the goat of Yom Kipur that got lost, were replaced, and were found before the replacement animals were brought. Rebbi Yehudah rules Yamusu. Rebbi Elazar and Rebbi Shimon hold - Yir'u (ad she'Yista'avu ... [they must e sent to graze until they obtain a blemish, when they are sold, and the proceeds go to Hekdesh]).

(b)This does not mean that Rebbi Yehudah considers the Chatas of partners worse than that of a Tzibur - because he holds 'Chatas Tzibur Meisah'.

(c)Rav Yosef refutes Abaye's proof from the latter - by citing the Pasuk in Acharei-Mos "al ha'Kohanim ve'al Kol Am ha'Kahal Yechaper" - which implies that the Kohanim are considered a Kahal.

(d)We disprove Rav Yosef's argument however, from the thirteen bulls that Rebbi Shimon obligates in our Mishnah, in the event that all the tribes sinned be'Shig'gas Hora'ah, since, if the Kohanim are considered a Kahal - they ought to bring one additional bull for the Kohanim.

6b----------------------------------------6b

7)

(a)What does ...

1. ... Rav Acha bar Ya'akov learn from the Pasuk in Vay'chi "Hin'ni Mafr'cha Ve'hirbisicha, u'Nesticha li'Kehal Amim, Ve'nasati es ha'Aretz ha'Zos le'Zar'acha Acharecha Achuzas Olam" (with regard to the tribe of Levi)?

2. ... Abaye learn from the Pasuk there "Efrayim u'Menasheh ki'Reuven ve'Shimon Yih'yu li"?

(b)Based on the Pasuk there "Al Shem Acheihem Yikar'u be'Nachalasam", how does Rava disprove Abaye's previous statement?

(c)According to Rava then, which is the twelfth tribe, regarding the 'Par He'elam Davar'?

(d)Then how about the Kohanim?

7)

(a)Rav Acha bar Ya'akov learns from the Pasuk in Vay'chi ...

1. ... "Hin'ni Mafr'cha Ve'hirbisicha, u'Nesticha li'Kehal Amim, Ve'nasati es ha'Aretz ha'Zos le'Zar'acha Acharecha Achuzas Olam" that - only those tribes that received an inheritance in Eretz Yisrael are counted as a Kahal (to preclude the tribe of Levi, which did not).

2. ... Efrayim u'Menasheh ki'Reuven u'Shimon Yih'yu li" that - to make up for the deficiency, Efrayim and Menasheh are counted as two tribes.

(b)Rava disproves the previous statement from the Pasuk there "Al Shem Acheihem Yikar'u be'Nachalasam" - implying that Efrayim and Menasheh are only considered two tribes as regards inheritance, but not in other matters (such as the 'Par He'elam Davar').

(c)According to Rava then, the twelfth tribe is Levi, which is considered a Kahal ...

(d)... even though the Kohanim are not.

8)

(a)If Efrayim and Menasheh are only considered two tribes as regards inheritance, then why did each have its own ...

1. ... flag?

2. ... Nasi?

(b)How do we prove this from Moshe, who organized twelve days of inauguration for the Mishkan?

(c)What is the source of the order of the flags, and the twelve tribes that they incorporated?

(d)What do we mean when we ask 'Mai Havi alah'?

8)

(a)Despite the fact that Efrayim and Menasheh are only considered two tribes as regards inheritance, each had its own ...

1. ... flag - because their encampment followed the same pattern as their inheritance (as we will see shortly).

2. ... Nasi - in keeping with the dignity of the flags.

(b)And we prove this from Moshe, who organized twelve days of inauguration for the Mishkan (in honor of the twelve princes) - when seven would otherwise have sufficed, like Shlomoh ha'Melech did when he inaugurated the Beis-Hamikdash.

(c)The source of the order of the flags, and the twelve tribes that they incorporated - was Ya'akov Avinu, who ordered his sons to carry his coffin in the same order that they would later encamp, and divide Eretz Yisrael into the equivalent twelve portions.

(d)When we ask 'Mai Havi alah', we mean to ask -whether we accept Abaye's ruling, that Rebbi Shimon holds 'Chatas ha'Shutfin Einah Meisah' (in which case the author of the Beraisa 'Meis Echad mi'Beis-Din, Peturin' can only be Rebbi Meir, and not Rebbi Shimon, as we explained).

9)

(a)The Beraisa lists five Chata'os that must die. Four of them are a V'lad (the baby born to a) Chatas, the Temurah (swap) of a Chatas, a Chatas whose owner has died and a Chatas that got lost and another brought in its place before it was found. What is the fifth?

(b)Why, does the Tana go on to say that, in the case of a Tzibur, there is no such thing as a ...

1. ... V'lad Chatas?

2. ... T'muras Chatas?

3. ... Chatas whose owner died?

(c)And what did he say about a Chatas that got lost and another is brought in its place before it is found, and one whose first year came to an end? Do they also not apply to the Chatas of a Tzibur?

(d)What is the Tana's conclusion?

9)

(a)The Beraisa lists five Chata'os that must die: A V'lad (the baby born to a) Chatas, the Temurah (swap) of a Chatas, a Chatas whose owner has died, a Chatas that got lost and another brought in its place before it was found - and a Chatas that has entered its second year.

(b)The Tana goes on to say that, in the case of a Tzibur, there is no such thing as a ...

1. ... V'lad Chatas - because the Tzibur never bring a female animal as a Chatas.

2. ... T'muras Chatas - because the Din of Temurah is confined to a Korban Yachid.

3. ... a Chatas whose owner died - because Ein Tzibur Meisah.

(c)As regards a Chatas that got lost and another is brought in its place before it is found, and one whose first year came to an end - (which are practically applicable to a Korban Tzibur), he stated that - he did not receive a tradition as to whether they apply to them Halachically or not.

(d)The Tana concludes however - that we learn what is not known from what is (in which case they will not apply to a Korban Tzibur, and we will apply the Din of 'Yir'eh').

10)

(a)What problem do we have learning the latter two from the former three (as we just did)?

(b)What do we answer?

(c)In actual fact, the Halachah only requires four Chata'os to die. Then why do we say five?

(d)How does this Beraisa now resolve our She'eilah? Does Rebbi Shimon hold Chatas ha'Shutfin Einah Meisah or not?

10)

(a)The problem with learning the latter two from the former three (as we just did) is that - we cannot learn a Halachah on something that is possible from something that is not.

(b)We answer that - Rebbi Shimon had a tradition that all the Chata'os that die apply under the same circumstances, either to a Korban Yachid, or to a Korban Tzibur as well (and if one doesn't apply, then none of them do).

(c)In actual fact, the Halachah only requires four Chata'os to die. We say five - because we are not sure to which one out of the five the Din 'Yir'eh' applies.

(d)This Beraisa resolves our She'eilah, in that, according to Rebbi Shimon - just as the first two (Chatas she'Meisah and Chatas Temurah) do not apply to partners (for the same reason as they do not apply to a Tzibur), neither do the other three (due to the same principle as they do not apply to a Tzibur).

Hadran alach 'Horu Beis-Din'

Perek Horu Kohen Mashi'ach

11)

(a)If a Kohen Mashi'ach issues an erroneous ruling but then sins on purpose, or vice-versa, he is Patur from a Chatas. Under what circumstances is he Chayav?

(b)What does he bring?

(c)And what does he bring in the cases where he is Patur?

11)

(a)If a Kohen Mashi'ach issues an erroneous ruling but then sins on purpose, or vice-versa, he is Patur from a Chatas. He is Chayav - only if both his ruling and his subsequent action are done be'Shogeg' ...

(b)... in which case he brings a Par (like the Tzibur).

(c)In the cases where he is Patur - he does not bring anything, since a Kohen Gadol is not Chayav a Korban for Shig'gas Ma'aseh (as we will see in the Sugya).

12)

(a)What problem do we have with the Reisha of the Mishnah, which actually spells out the ruling obligating the Kohen Gadol?

(b)So how do we establish the case (to create a Chidush)?

(c)What is then the Chidush? Why might we have thought that he should be Patur?

12)

(a)The problem with the Reisha of the Mishnah, which actually spells out the ruling obligating the Kohen Gadol, is that - it seems obvious and hardly warrants mentioning.

(b)So, to create a Chidush, we establish the case where the Kohen Gadol forgot which ruling he issued, and proceeded to perform the sin on condition that this is what he originally ruled.

(c)We might otherwise have thought that he is Patur - because, since he is aware that this may not be what he permitted, and, should he have recalled what he ruled, he might have retracted, it is considered Meizid, and he is Patur.

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