More Discussions for this daf
1. Who was R'Eliezer ben Yaakov's teacher 2. paskening in front of a rebbi 3. Renting space for an Eruv
4. Renting space for an Eruv 5. Perhaps he might learn from his actions
DAF DISCUSSIONS - ERUVIN 62

Jeff Ram asked:

Dear Rabbi Kornfeld:

On daf 62, we learn that the Rabanan say that an 'akum' will not be "moger" to rent his share of the chatzer to a Jew. I translated that to mean that the 'akum' "will not want to rent it to the Jew", and therefore, it will be difficult for a Jew to live together in the same chatzer with a goy. It seems to imply that the Jew may NOT make this eruv chatzeros "on his own" (as he can with other Jews - he can be m'kabel z'chus she'lo befanav, and make an eruv for everyone) But regarding a goy, It seems that the goy MUST be actively involved and have specific knowledge of the terms of the Jew's "rental" of the goy's share of the chatzer. So it seems that the Jew can NOT be "m'kabel z'chus she'lo befanav" on behalf of a goy. That is to say that the Jew can NOT accept money on the goy's behalf, as payment for a rental of the chatzer that they share, without the specific knowledge of this goy.

I was bothered by this regarding modern apartment/condominium buildings where (especially in 'chutz la'aretz') numbers of Jewish families and numbers of gentile families live in the same building. They share the stairwells, lobby area and hallways, all as chatzeros - requiring an eruv chatzeros. The goy certainly understands when he buys the apartment or condo that all the other tenants in the building have free access to, and will be using these common areas. In fact, I believe that in every condominium bill of sale (or "rules" of the condominium - a book which every owner receives), that fact is part of the agreement. Therefore, I have 4 questions regarding these modern day living arrangements:

1) Assuming there is no specifically written agreement between the Jew and
the goy regarding the common areas, the goy certainly understands that
everyone in the building will be using the common areas, what is the
obligation of the Jew who lives in one of these buildings of eruvei
chatzeros? Does he even have to do it?
If so, can he "force" the goy, as we force a Jew "al midas S'dom"
If there is a written condominium association agreement, stating that all
tenants have rights to use the common areas, is this a type of document
that would substitute for a "shtar Sechirus?
If yes, is there a need for a separate eruv chatzeros?
Does the fact that the gentile tenant knows that everyone will use the
common areas affect eruv chatzeros?
If eruv chatzeros must still be made, with or without an agreement
serving as a "shtar Sechirus", must the Jew make a specific rental
agreement with each gentile tenant in the building? (making eruv
chatzeros in our large, modern day buildings a practical impossibility).
(This then, would seem to go against the da'as Chachamim, who just wanted
to make it inconvenient , as a "dis-incentive", so Jews would not choose
to live with gentiles; but could , in cases of need.)

If all of the tenants of the building agree to pay a monthly "vaad haBayit", or maintenance fee that covers the upkeep of the common areas, (but without any written agreement) does this type of agreement help regarding making eruv chatzeros? Does this agreement need to be written in contract form? Does it help if the agreement is informal, it's just "understood" and agreed by all that everyone pays a set maintenance fee, but there is no contract?

2) In the situation described in question #1, what are the requirements for
eruv chatzeros in a case where a condominium owner rents his (fully
furnished) condominium to someone else.

a) does it matter if the owner is a Jew and the renter a goy? (or vice
versa?)

b) what about renting a totally non-furnished condominium?

3) What are the obligations of eruv chatzeros while renting rooms in a
hotel (where both Jews and gentiles reside) in the following cases;

a) in a "standard" type of hotel, when you've rented a bedroom for a
"short term" (a few days)?

b) in a "residence" hotel, where the tenants may rent complete living
quarters for a "long term"; that being months or even years?

4) Many in Israel live in a situation (L'tzareinu) where the tenants of the
building are all Jews, but some of these Jews deny the authority of the
Rabanan, and reject the idea of Eruv all together. They will have no part
of any type of "arrangement" to make any type of eruv. Can a Jew, who
wishes to carry from his apartment into the common areas; e.g. the
stairwell and/or lobby make an eruv chatzeros by being "m'kabel z'chus
she'lo befanav? (setting aside bread for each of the dayarim without their
knowledge?)

I look forward to your answers.

The Kollel replies:

1) Any Chatzer is communal property and recognized as such. The problem

which requires the tikun of Eruv Chatzeros is the private ownership of the

houses that open into the Chatzer. Where a Non-jew lives in the chatzer,

Chazal required Sechirus of his Reshus in order that his presence

should not prevent the Jews from taking things from their houses into the

Chatzer. Therefore, regardless of the fact that the communal areas are

accepted as such, we still need Sechirus to permit carrying from the

apartments to the communal areas.

Some Halachos of Sechirus Reshus found in O.C.382 which I hope will clarify

the issues of questions 1 and 2. (The #'s in parentheses refer to Seifim of

Shulchan Aruch).

* It is not necessary to specify the purpose of the sechirus or to draw up

any kind of contract. (#4)

*The sechirus can be paid with even less than a Shave Peruta. (#5)

*The Sechirus remains valid indefinitely as long as the non-jew does not

retract and return the money (#6)

*Sechirus may be contracted with an employee of the non-jew (#11) the Mishna

Berura (#35) explains that this refers to an employee who has the authority

to employ others and enter his employers home. If there is a janitor in the

complex who has this authority to do repairs and such then it would be

sufficient to contract sechirus with him.

*If a non-jew rents his apartment to another non-jew and leaves some of his

possesions in the apartment then Sechirus from the original owner is still

valid. Even if nothing of the owner's is left in the apartment, if the

owner has the right to evict his tenant then Sechirus from the owner is

still valid. (#18).

3)In a hotel where rooms are rented for less than 30 days there is no need

for an Eruv. In each room there is furniture which is the property of the

owner and cannot be moved on Shabbos due to it's size or because of Muktze.

The owner, therefore retains rights to the room and no eruv is required.

(O.C 370 #2)

In a situation where rooms are rented out for longer periods, Sechirus

would be required from non-jews. If there is a common dining room where all the Jews ate then no Eruv would be required (#4)

4) O.C. 385 #3 states: A Jew who is Mumar Lechalel Shabbos publicly has the

same Din as a non-Jew for inclusion in an eruv. Therefore Sechirus Reshus

is required. An important difference is that Sechirus from a Jew requires

payment of at least a Shave Peruta (382 M.B.#21).