ZEVACHIM 74 (13 Tamuz) - Today's Dafyomi study is dedicated to the blessed memory of U.S. Army Staff Sgt. Seymour Ira Gottlieb (Yitzchak Shimon ben Chaim Shlomo Yosef ha'Levi, Z"L), who died in World War II on the 13th of Tamuz 5704 in the battle of St. Lo, France, fighting the Nazis to save his Jewish brethren in Europe.

1)

(a)Rav Nachman ... Amar Rav discusses a ring of Avodah-Zarah that falls into a hundred rings, one of which then falls the sea. What is a ring of Avodah-Zarah?

(b)He rules that all the remaining rings are permitted. Why is that?

(c)How did Rava query Rav Nachman on this from our Mishnah Afilu Achas be'Ribu, Yamusu Kulan?

(d)Like whom did Rav Nachman establish Rav, to answer Rava's Kashya?

1)

(a)Rav Nachman ... Amar Rav discusses a ring of Avodah-Zarah that falls into a hundred rings, one of which then falls the sea. A ring of Avodah-Zarah is - one which adorns the idol.

(b)He rules that all the remaining rings are permitted - because we assume the one that fell into the sea to have been the forbidden one.

(c)Rava queried Rav Nachman on this from our Mishnah Afilu Achas be'Ribu, Yamusu Kulan - whereas, according to Rav, as soon as the first one dies, the rest ought to be permitted.

(d)To answer Rava's Kashya, Rav Nachman establishes Rav - like Rebbi Eliezer, who permits all the heads on the basis of the one that was sacrificed.

2)

(a)We query Rav Nachman's answer however, from Rebbi Elazar, who establishes Rebbi Eliezer where the remaining heads are brought two by two. Why is that?

(b)How does Rav Nachman reconcile Rav's previous ruling (which he himself just quoted) with Rebbi Elazar?

2)

(a)We query Rav Nachman's answer however, from Rebbi Elazar, who establishes Rebbi Eliezer where the remaining heads are brought two by two - because we assume that just as one of the rings must be a ring of Heter, so too, is the other one ('Migu').

(b)Rav Nachman reconciles Rav's previous ruling (which he himself just quoted) with Rebbi Elazar - by establishing Rav where the owner sells the rings two by two, even though Rav did not specifically say so.

3)

(a)If a ring of Avodah-Zarah falls into a hundred rings and, after the rings are divided into groups of sixty and forty and one out of the group of forty falls into another batch of rings, why does Rav permit the latter batch?

(b)And why did he initially forbid the same batch of rings, assuming that it was one of the group of sixty rings from which the ring fell?

(c)What problem do we have with this latter ruling?

(d)So what distinction did Rav really draw between the two groups?

3)

(a)If a ring of Avodah-Zarah falls into a hundred rings and, after they rings are divided into groups of sixty and forty, one out of the group of forty falls into another batch of rings, Rav permits the latter batch - because he assumes the forbidden ring to still be among the majority (the group of sixty rings).

(b)He initially forbade the same batch of rings, assuming that it was one of the group of sixty rings from which the ring fell - for the same reason (because he assumed the Isur to have been among those sixty from which the ring fell).

(c)The problem with this latter ruling is that - we still ought to permit the ring which fell into the latter batch, on the assumption that the forbidden ring is still among the fifty-nine remaining rings.

(d)The distinction that Rav really drew between the two groups is that - if the group of forty were to fall into another batch, it would be permitted (because we assume the forbidden ring to be in the group of sixty; whereas if the group of sixty fell ... , it would be forbidden.

4)

(a)What would be the Din if for example, the forty separated from the sixty without falling into another batch of rings?

(b)Why is that? In what way does this differ from the previous ruling?

4)

(a)If for example, the forty separated from the sixty without falling into another batch of rings - they would remain Asur according to everybody, even Rebbi Eliezer ...

(b)... because this latter case is a question of Bitul be'Rov, which we do not say by Avodah-Zarah, whereas S'fek S'feika we do.

5)

(a)Shmuel disagrees with Rav's previous ruling. What does he say about every Safek and S'fek S'feika of Avodah-Zarah?

(b)What does the Beraisa say about a case where ...

1. ... a cup of Avodah-Zarah that falls into a storeroom full of cups?

2. ... one of those cups then falls into ten thousand cups, one of which falls into another ten thousand cups (see Tosfos DH 'Peirash')?

(c)Why is that?

(d)How does Shmuel reconcile his opinion (forbidding even S'fek S'feika by Avodah-Zarah) with this Beraisa?

5)

(a)Shmuel disagrees with Rav's previous ruling. He maintains that - every Safek and S'fek S'feika of Avodah-Zarah is forbidden.

(b)The Beraisa rules that in a case where ...

1. ... a cup of Avodah-Zarah falls into a storeroom full of cups - all the cups are forbidden.

2. ... one of those cups then falls into ten thousand cups, one of which fell into another ten thousand cups (see Tosfos DH 'Peirash') - they are all permitted ...

(c)... because of S'fek S'feika.

(d)Shmuel reconciles his opinion (forbidding even S'fek S'feika by Avodah-Zarah) with this Beraisa - by citing a Machlokes Tana'im in the matter, and by aligning himself with the Tana who argues with the Beraisa [as we will now see]).

6)

(a)Rebbi Yehudah in a Beraisa, maintains that pomegranates of Baden render forbidden even a Kol she'Hu, even in the case of S'fek S'feika. Which Isurim is he referring to?

(b)Rebbi Shimon ben Yehudah Amar Rebbi Shimon is lenient in the case of S'fek S'feika. What is the significance of pomegranates of Baden in this Machlokes?

(c)What problem do we have with establishing Shmuel like Rebbi Yehudah?

(d)Why can we not answer that Shmuel holds like Rebbi Shimon who agrees with Rebbi Yehudah with regard to Avodah-Zarah?

6)

(a)Rebbi Yehudah in a Beraisa, maintains that pomegranates of Baden render forbidden even a Kol she'Hu, even if it is a S'fek S'feika - with regard to Orlah and Terumah.

(b)Rebbi Shimon ben Yehudah Amar Rebbi Shimon - is lenient in the case of S'fek S'feika - despite the fact that 'pomegranates of Baden' is one of the six things that are not subject to Bitul.

(c)The problem with establishing Shmuel like Rebbi Yehudah is that - Rebbi Yehudah is strict with regard to all Isurim, not just by Avodah-Zarah (as Shmuel is).

(d)Nor can we answer that Shmuel holds like Rebbi Shimon who agrees with Rebbi Yehudah with regard to Avodah-Zarah - because in another Beraisa, he specifically incorporates Avodah-Zarah in the leniency of S'fek S'feika.

7)

(a)So how do we finally establish Shmuel, to solve the problem?

(b)When Rebbi Shimon permits S'fek S'feika by Rimonei Baden, the Lashon he employs is ' ... u'mi'Ribu li'Sheloshah, u'mi'Sheloshah le'Makom Acher'. Why must the pomegranate fall into three pomegranates, when two is already a Rov?

(c)Alternatively, Shmuel holds like Rebbi Eliezer. What does Rebbi Eliezer say about bread that is baked in an oven that has been heated with wood from an Asheirah that twice got mixed up with other loaves?

(d)What does this teach us?

(e)This last answer might refer to Rebbi Shimon (and not to Shmuel). What do we then mean by making him compatible with Rebbi Eliezer? Which statement of Rebbi Eliezer are we then referring to?

7)

(a)We finally solve the problem - by establishing Shmuel like Rebbi Shimon regarding other Isurim, but like Rebbi Yehudah regarding Avodah-Zarah.

(b)When Rebbi Shimon permits S'fek S'feika by Rimonei Baden, the Lashon he employs is ' ... u'mi'Ribu li'Sheloshah, u'mi'Sheloshah le'Makom Acher' - the three includes the pomegranate of Isur that fell into the two.

(c)Alternatively, Shmuel holds like Rebbi Eliezer, who rules that bread that is baked in an oven that has been heated with wood from an Asheirah that twice got mixed up with other loaves - remains forbidden, until the owner takes the value of the benefit he derives from the baking and throws it into the Yam ha'Melach.

(d)Rebbi Eliezer then, is the Tana who forbids even S'fek S'feika by Avodah-Zarah (and he serves as Shmuel's source).

(e)This last answer might refer to Rebbi Shimon - who then concurs with Rebbi Eliezer, who only permits Avodah-Zarah two at a time (as Rebbi Elazar learned earlier). On that basis, all the pomegranates will only be permitted if the forbidden pomegranate falls into three other pomegranates.

74b----------------------------------------74b

8)

(a)What does Resh Lakish say about a barrel of Terumah wine that became mixed up with a hundred barrels of ordinary wine, if one of them then fell into the sea?

(b)This ruling is synonymous with that of Rav Nachman Amar Rav regarding a ring of Avodah-Zarah. Having taught us ...

1. ... Rav's ruling, why is it necessary to add that of Resh Lakish?

2. ... Resh Lakish's ruling, why is it necessary to add that of Rav?

(c)On what grounds does Rabah restrict Resh Lakish's ruling to a barrel of wine (but not to a fig)

(d)What does Rav Yosef say?

8)

(a)Resh Lakish rules that if a barrel of Terumah wine became mixed up with a hundred barrels of ordinary wine, and one of them then fell into the sea - all the barrels are permitted.

(b)This ruling is synonymous with that of Rav Nachman Amar Rav regarding a ring of Avodah-Zarah. In spite of having taught us ...

1. ... Rav's ruling, it is necessary to add that of Resh Lakish - to teach us that we rely on the one that got mixed up being the Isur even by Terumah, which is a Davar she'Yesh lo Matirin (something that can be rectified, which is generally not subject to Bitul).

2. ... Resh Lakish's ruling, it is nevertheless necessary to add that of Rav - even though a ring is so small that one does not realize that it has fallen into the batch, in which case one may come to permit it on its own, even without it having falling into it.

(c)Rabah restricts Resh Lakish's ruling to a barrel of wine (but not to a fig) - because of the latter's size, as we just explained according to Resh Lakish. In Rabah's opinion, Rav holds like Resh Lakish, but Resh Lakish does not hold like Rabah.

(d)Rav Yosef - holds that just as a fig renders Asur (in spite of its size), so too, does it become Bateil.

9)

(a)What lenient ruling did Rebbi Elazar issue regarding a barrel of Terumah wine that falls into a batch of a hundred barrels of ordinary wine?

(b)What problem did Rav Nachman have with this ruling when Rav Dimi told him about it?

(c)How did he therefore amend the initial statement?

9)

(a)Rebbi Elazar ruled that if a barrel of Terumah wine falls into a batch of a hundred barrels of ordinary wine - one may open one of the barrels and remove one hundredth of the total from the wine (which must be given to a Kohen).

(b)When Rav Dimi told Rav Nachman about it, he asked - why the Mishnah in Orlah (that we quoted above) then incorporates closed barrels in the list of things that are not subject to Bitul, when all it needs to permit it is to open the barrels.

(c)He therefore amended the initial statement to read (not that one may open one of the barrels ... , but) if one of the barrels was (inadvertently) opened ... '.

10)

(a)In a case where a barrel of Terumah wine becomes mixed up with a hundred and fifty barrels of ordinary wine, and a hundred of those barrels are subsequently opened, what did Rebbi Oshaya say vis-a-vis ...

1. ... the hundred barrels?

2. ... the remaining fifty barrels?

(b)What is the Chidush? What might we otherwise have thought?

10)

(a)In a case where a barrel of Terumah wine becomes mixed up with a hundred and fifty barrels of ordinary wine, and a hundred of those barrels are subsequently opened, Rebbi Oshaya ...

1. ... permits the hundred barrels once one hundredth of the wine has been removed.

2. ... forbids the remaining fifty barrels, until such time as they too, are opened.

(b)The Chidush is that - we do not permit the fifty barrels automatically on the grounds that the Asur barrel is among the hundred (like Rav Yehudah Amar Rav said earlier [Shitah Mekubetzes]).

11)

(a)Our Mishnah rules that if Zevachim become mixed up with Rove'a, Nirva, Muktzah ... or T'reifah, Yir'u ad she'Yista'avu. What problem do we have with T'reifah?

(b)de'bei Rebbi Yanai establishes our Mishnah where the Korban was pierced by a thorn, and the T'reifah animal, by a wolf. How far did the holes penetrate?

(c)Why is the former not a Ba'al-Mum anyway?

11)

(a)Our Mishnah rules that if Zevachim become mixed up with Rove'a, Nirva, Muktzah ... or T'reifah, Yir'u ad she'Yista'avu. The problem with T'reifah is that - if it is identifiable, then why can he not simply remove it, whereas if it is not, then how does one know that it is a T'reifah?

(b)de'bei Rebbi Yanai establishes our Mishnah where the Korban was pierced by a thorn, and the T'reifah animal, by a wolf, in a way that - the holes penetrated the flesh, but did not pierce through to the cavity (otherwise it would be T'reifah in any case).

(c)The former is not a Ba'al-Mum anyway - because it is curable.

12)

(a)According to Resh Lakish, the T'reifah animal fell down from a roof (and its T'reifus cannot be detected externally). What then is the case? At which stage did they Shecht the animal?

(b)Why did they not examine the animal by seeing if it stood up by itself or even walked?

(c)Rebbi Yirmiyah establishes T'reifah by the baby of a T'reifah, according to Rebbi Eliezer. What does Rebbi Eliezer say about the baby of a T'reifah?

(d)Why do ...

1. ... Resh Lakish and Rebbi Yirmiyah reject Rebbi Yanai's answer?

2. ... Rebbi Yanai and Rebbi Yirmiyah reject Resh Lakish's answer?

3. ... Rebbi Yanai and Resh Lakish reject Rebbi Yirmiyah's answer?

12)

(a)According to Resh Lakish, the T'reifah animal fell down from a roof (and its T'reifus cannot be detected externally). And the case is - where the animal was unable to stand up by itself, and was subsequently Shechted within twenty-four hours.

(b)Examining the animal by seeing if it stood up by itself would not have helped either - because according to Resh Lakish, even if it had, it would still need to live twenty-four hours (and even if it actually walked, it would still require examination).

(c)Rebbi Yirmiyah establishes T'reifah by the baby of a T'reifah like Rebbi Eliezer, who rules that - the baby of a T'reifah is disqualified from going on the Mizbe'ach, like the T'reifah itself.

(d)The reason that ...

1. ... Resh Lakish and Rebbi Yirmiyah reject Rebbi Yanai's answer is - because an animal that has been pierced by a thorn, and one that has been pierced by a wolf are easily distinguishable, since the former is round, whereas the latter is elongated (as caused by the movement of the wolf's claw).

2. ... Rebbi Yanai and Rebbi Yirmiyah reject Resh Lakish's answer is - because they hold that once the animal stands up, it does not need to live twenty-four hours, and once it walks, it no longer requires examination.

3. ... Rebbi Yanai and Resh Lakish reject Rebbi Yirmiyah's answer - because they prefer to avoid establishing our Mishnah like Rebbi Eliezer, who is a Shamuti (either he was from the School of Beis Shamai or he was in Cherem).

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