ANSWERS TO REVIEW QUESTIONS

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prepared by Rabbi Eliezer Chrysler of Kollel Iyun Hadaf

daf@dafyomi.co.il, www.dafyomi.co.il

Rosh Kollel: Rabbi Mordecai Kornfeld

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SHABBOS 42

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1) click for question

(a) It is permitted to extinguish a hot piece of metal lying in the street, but not a burning wooden faggot - because whereas extinguishing a hot faggot constitutes an Isur d'Oraysa, and is therefore prohibited, even to prevent people from getting hurt, extinguishing a hot metal bar is only an Isur de'Rabbanan, which Chazal waived in face of public safety. (See also Rabeinu Chananel)

(b) We ask that, since Shmuel holds like Rebbi Shimon by 'Davar she'Ein Miskaven', why is he not lenient here too, like Rebbi Shimon. We presume that, since Shmuel follows the opinion of Rebbi Shimon with regard to 'Davar she'Ein Miskaven', he will also hold like him in 'Melachah she'Einah Tz'richah le'Gufah', Consequently, what we mean to ask is - the faggot of wood is no more an Isur d'Oraysa than is the metal bar, so why does Shmuel rule stringently with regard to it?

(c) We reply that, in fact - Shmuel follows the opinion of Rebbi Shimon only with regard to 'Davar she'Ein Miskaven', but that, as far as 'Melachah she'Einah Tzerichah' is concerned, he rules like Rebbi Yehudah, and the wooden faggot therefore does indeed constitute an Isur d'Oraysa.

2) click for question

(a) One may move out of harm's way, dangerous thorns...

1. ... that one finds in a Reshus ha'Rabim - at intervals of less than four Amos at a time.

2. ... that one finds in a Karmelis - in the normal manner.

(b) The reason for the difference is - because carrying in the Reshus ha'Rabim is Asur d'Oraysa, for which the punishment is Kares, whereas carrying in a Karmelis is only an Isur de'Rabbanan. In both cases, one will now be performing an Isur de'Rabbanan, which the Rabbanan waived in face of the potential harm.

3) click for question

(a) Beis Shamai permit pouring hot water into cold, but not vice-versa, because they hold 'Tata'ah Gavar' - i.e. whatever lies in the vessel, affects what is being poured into it (and not vice-versa). Consequently, if the water in the vessel is cold, the hot water being poured into it will not boil the cold water, but rather will be cooled down by it.

(b) Beis Hillel forbid pouring cold water into hot water in a bath-tub which is a K'li Rishon (or even if it a K'li Sheni - because, for bathing, one wants the water very hot, which is Asur because the water in a bath-tub is so hot that people will think that it is a K'li Rishon - Tosfos, DH 'Aval'). They permit pouring even cold water into hot when it is in a K'li Sheni, and is also for drinking - because nobody will think that the water in a cup (which is for drinking) is a K'li Rishon, because people do not normally want drinking-water to be so hot.

4) click for question

(a) Abaye asks on Rav Yosef from the Beraisa of Rebbi Chiya - which writes that a dish does not have the Din of a bath-tub, so how can Rav Yosef say that it does?

(b) If we rule like Rebbi Shimon ben Menasya, who forbids the pouring even of hot water into cold in a bath-tub, and we also rule that pouring hot water into a dish (for washing purposes) has the same Din as pouring it into a bath-tub, as Rav Yosef contends - how can one wash at all with hot water on Shabbos? Does this mean that Chazal canceled all facilities for washing with hot water on Shabbos?

(c) We answer by establishing Rebbi Shimon ben Menasya on the Reisha - where Beis Hillel permitted the pouring of even of cold water into hot - into a cup for drinking. And it is with that contention which Rebbi Shimon ben Menasya disagrees. According to him, cold water into hot water is forbidden, even in a cup. (He does not discuss pouring hot water into cold, as we thought at first).

(d) This does not however, mean that Rebbi Shimon ben Menasya holds like Beis Shamai - because even though Rebbi Shimon ben Menasya quotes Beis Shamai, it is not because he holds like them, but because, in his opinion, Beis Hillel agree with that. There is, in fact, no Machlokes.

5) click for question

(a) We initially explain Rebbi Chiya's Beraisa 'Nosen Adam Kiton shel Mayim le'Toch Sefel Shel Mayim, Bein Chamin le'Toch Tzonan, Bein Tzonan le'Toch Chamin' to mean - that that one may place a flask of hot water into cold water, or vice-versa.

(b) Rava could not have then learnt from there the concession of pouring even cold water into hot water or vice-versa - because the Beraisa's concession is confined to a case where the wall of the vessel divided between the hot water and the cold.

(c) We therefore amend the Beraisa to read 'Shofech' instead of 'Nosen' (that one is permitted to pour [rather than to place] a flask of water etc.).

42b----------------------------------------42b

6) click for question

(a) It is forbidden to place spices into a hot K'li Rishon, even after it has been removed from the stove - because a K'li Rishon continues to cook (even after it has been removed from the stove), as long as it is still hot.

(b) On the other hand, it is permitted to add spices to a dish or plate containing hot food - because a K'li Sheni does not cook.

(c) Rebbi Yehudah says 'la'Kol Hu Nosen, Chutz mi'Davar She'Yesh bo Chometz ve'Tzir' - because vinegar and juice that drips from pickled fish, are exceptionally sharp, and will therefore cause spices to cook when they are hot. (We will clarify later whether Rebbi Yehudah is speaking about a K'li Rishon or a K'li Sheni).

7) click for question

(a) 'Rebbi Yehudah Omer, la'Kol Hu Nosen - Chutz mi'Davar she'Yesh Bo Chometz ve'Tzir'. We are uncertain whether Rebbi Yehudah permits cooking even in a K'li Rishon once it has been removed from the flame, or whether he comes to qualify the concession of cooking in a K'li Sheni (which the Tana Kama permits categorically), to prohibit cooking even in a K'li Sheni, dishes which contain vinegar or fish-juice.

(b) Based on the wording of a Beraisa - we conclude that Rebbi Yehudah is lenient even in a K'li Rishon (like the first suggestion).

8) click for question

(a) Rav Yosef thought that salt has the same Din as spices when it comes to putting it into a hot K'li Rishon or K'li Sheni. Abaye, again quoting a Beraisa of Rebbi Chiya, points out that salt is not like spices. But there are two versions of what the Beraisa said. One of the versions concurs with Rav Nachman's statement 'Tzericha Milcha Bishula ke'Bisra de'Tura' - meaning that salt takes a long, long time to cook, like the meat of an ox. Practically, this means that one may place both ox meat and salt into a K'li Rishon, which has been removed from the stove, because neither will cook in a pot that is not actually on the stove.

(b) The other version holds that salt is not like spices, because it cooks even in a K'li Sheni.

9) click for question

(a) The Tana of our Mishnah permits one to place a receptacle underneath a dripping lamp - before Shabbos, but not on Shabbos.

(b) This does not mean that the oil is then permitted. On the contrary, our Mishnah writes 've'Ein Ne'osin Mimenu, Lefi she'Eino Min ha'Muchan'.

(c) Rav Chisda learns from our Mishnah, that one may not place a receptacle under a chicken which is laying an egg on a slope, but that one is permitted to place it over an egg in a trash-heap to prevent it from being trodden on and broken. Rabah explains - that the Tana of our Mishnah forbids one to place a vessel under a chicken to save the egg from rolling, because it is uncommon for a chicken to lay eggs on a slope (similar to our Mishnah, where it is uncommon for an oil lamp to drip). But they did permit one to take a vessel to save (even) an egg (despite the fact that the egg itself is Muktzah), which the chicken is about to lay in a trash-heap - from being trodden on, because it is common for the chicken to lay its eggs there. In short, Chazal permitted one to take a vessel to save even something that is Muktzah, provided it is to save from a loss which is common.

10) click for question

(a) The Mishnah or Beraisa which permits one to place ...

1. ... a receptacle underneath a barrel of Tevel wine, that is escaping from a broken barrel - is speaking about a new barrel, and it is common for new barrels to break;

2. ... a receptacle underneath a lamp to catch the sparks - because it is common for sparks to fall from a burning lamp;

3. ... a dish over a lamp to prevent the beam from burning - speaks about a house with a low ceiling, where fires are common;

4. ... a bench to support a broken beam - speaks in the case of a new house, where it is common for beams to break.

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